CircuPool?

[RonPace]

I am looking at salt water chlorine generator for a 100M3 pool.

The one that stands out, on the internet anyway, is CircuPool - the 35 or 55. It is certainly the neatest and boasts an 8 year warranty. But typically they do not appear to have a dealer in France although Amazon france does advertise them but with the annoying 'not currently available' proviso. But I see they are used by some in Italy and Germany....

Does anyone use one of these and be happy to share comments?

[Teapot1]

Ron, spare parts! How easy are they to obtain? With brands like Hayward and Zodiac parts will be easily obtainable in the EU or UK.
A lot of the companies have been purchased by the fluidra company, also known as BWT if you remember last seasons F1 pink car.

[Denniswiseman]

One thing to bare in mind is that they are rated for 24/7
A 100m3 is 100,000 litres (26,417 US gallons) and the 55 is rated for 55,000 US gallons

[Teapot1]

Hope to re model my pool next year, going to be changing to salt also but a low salt hydroxyl hybrid sanitiser. A lot more powerful and should breakdown bodyfats and suncreams etc. My pool is already really good so not sure how much better it will get.
Rather than UV which won't do much for an outdoor pool without a cover there are hybrid UV hydroxyl systems that again can breakdown contaminents that chlorine can't. Made in the UK if you are feeling patriotic for your homeland hahaha

[RonPace]

Interesting. In my internet surfing on genertors, I am reading stuff on these new technology ideas, but they are going over my head!

Bio-UV are putting out a good story about what they can do with minimal salt.

OK, here is a question - to be future proofed, and starting with a clean sheet, what is the way forward for an outdoor pool that will give minimal work and good sanitisation..?

[Teapot1]

Ron have you a link to the new BioUV stuff?, they were good at stretching the truth before.
Starting with a clean sheet:
A winter cover as previously stated.
Dryden Aqua's AFM filter media. The more dirt you remove the better and longer the chlorine lasts. You'll only need to buy it once.
Variable speed control on your pump, the electricity saving will pay for all the other modifications and purchases.
I can help with explanations of the hydroxyl tech. Been in the industry for 18 ish years but retired from it at least for now.

[RonPace]

Yes - here is the link to one of their systems, there are more that look to be much the same. Basically it seems that they have combined UV and a swcg into one....I'd be interested in your comments.
https://en.bio-uv.com/oclear

I appreciate that a cover will do a lot, but I just do not like them, so will have to pay the price!

What is this AFM filter? Is it available in pool shops? I have just had my filter filled with glass media from Irrijardin (a French national pool co). Maybe the same?

I just called CircuPool. Forget them. He could not have been less interested in a possible sale. Spoke in a most dreadful texan drawl, that in itself was going to kill any sale dead!

Thinking that if I go with tradition and get a well rated swcg, and your note about spares, of the EU/UK products available, what is the chieftan tank of them all?

[Teapot1]

Hi Ron,
Thanks for the bioUV link, they rattle on as they always have done about stinging eyes skin rash etc but none of this occurs in a well run outdoor pool. Thin on actual data and facts also no sight of the chlorine generator or spec. To easily produce chlorine from a salt solution you need reasonable conductivity and so 3500ppm of salt or thereabouts is added to the pool. This can cause corrosion problems and the pump needs to be able to cope with salt solution as should other parts.
Low salt versions like I am looking at use around 1500ppm of salt to produce a conductive solution. At that level it is a bit harder to produce chlorine but the extra energy splits the water and produces hydroxyl radicals, these are short live highly reactive particles more powerful than Ozone which allows them to breakdown most contaminents in the water including body oils etc. They react and then recombine and the process continues.
BioUV state they use 500ppm of salt so making it harder to produce chlorine as the mix is less conductive so more power would be required and the higher amount of hydroxl radicals would in theory be produced but they don't state that or mention hydroxyl radicals which is curious. Also to produce hydroxyl radicals with UV would normally require a catalyst, often titanium, again this is not mentioned??
https://sugar-valley.nl/en/sugar-valley-oxilife/ This is one of the systems I was looking at, please have a read.
https://www.elecro.co.uk/products/aquat ... s/quantum/ This being another UV hybrid hydroxyl radical producing unit (would require a chlorine generator).

Your glass filtration is probably better than sand but is not AFM which is specially treated to charge the surface allowing no biofouling of the surface and removal of micro particles via the charge rather than just mechanical filtration. https://www.drydenaqua.com/
It is available in France but is always labelled AFM even though it comes from a French distributor. I couldn't distribute enough for the contract at the time so it went to Bayrol who,s name will be on all the bags. The latest version is AFM ng a second generation product, I have the original and its been in for 16 years!
https://www.drydenaqua.com/afm/afm-ng

Regarding good chlorine generators, lower power consumption usually means switch mode power supplies, these do not seem to last as long as the old power hungry versions but use a fraction of the electricity. Usually replaceable and why I mentioned spare parts, depending on how much chlorine the cell produces will determine the cells life span and these are not cheap. That is why we recommend using liquid chlorine to shock with.
The cleaner the water, the more efficient the filtration the less chlorine you will need as it will last longer. Another fantastic product from Dryden aqua is ACO this is activated by sunlight to help sterilise the water and protect the chlorine from being burned up by the sun's UV, we normally use cyanuric acid stabiliser but that weakens the chlorine action, ACO improves it. I have used ACO and CYA simultaneously to good effect.
The Dryden Aqua DA gen is a salt water chlorinator and hydroxyl producing unit using 1500ppm of salt. This unit was the one I introduced Dr Dryden to several years ago!

So I sound like an advert for Dryden Aqua, well no one company has done as much to improve swimming pool water quality and by that the health of the swimmers. They are marine biologists and also do a lot more around the world with aquatic environments and cleaning up the pollution in rivers in India etc also the purification of drinking water in poor parts of the world with the Wave filter. https://cleanwaterwave.com/our-team/dr-howard-dryden/

[RonPace]

Thanks for the comments, you certainly seem to know your way around the various products so sharing info is appreciated.

Regarding the Bio-UV, it sounded good on the screen and would be in my monetary allowance for this change. As it happens my supplier Irrijardin is a supplier of their kit and has a unit in stock, but on asking, they know diddly squat on what it does. So a big miss there!

Dryden? never heard of them! But reading up on them this morning, they sound to have much credential. I was fired up on the Aqua DA, but sadly, I have to admit that the product is sadly out of my league.

I am reading up on the other two, but the one from Sugar Valley is vague, or have I got the wrong link? The other, the Vulcan, is well described, well engineered by the sounds of it and importantly have a vast dealership. You say that it needs a swcg - this then makes it the same principle as the Bio-UV, yes? At at what I think is a competitive price. What swcg would you recommend to put along side one of these? I am mindful of a comment made by Dennis early that these units should be rated for 24/7.

Many thanks. I feel I might be getting somewhere...

[Teapot1]

Hi Ron,
The one from Sugar valley is the Dryden DA, I introduced them to it!
I know a fair bit about it.
The Quantum, yes the BioUV sounds similar by the marketing material but no mention of titanium which will be needed to produce hydroxyl radicals in any useful amount, producing only a tiny amount will not do the job. Also you can see the length of the quantum unit single or Twin chamber, compared to to short length of the BioUV unit, you need a contact time for any UV to work well in a short unit this would be minimal and so would be the effect.
Sorry if I sound down on BioUV but I have had to deal with customers years ago who had their units and hydrogen peroxide liquid an expensive combination that may work on paper or in the lab but was not effective in rural France.

[RonPace]

OK, if the Sugar Valley is the Dryden one, then I have to discount it on price. I am sure they are good, but there comes a point where price is a consideration.

This leaves the Vulcan. Been reading more on it this morning and sounds ok. What is your answer to a suitable swcg? I am looking at the Zodiac range - only because they are prolific around here.

[RonPace]

Hang on, some confusion here - Quantum and Vulcan. Are there differences?

jeez, I wish these manufacturers would be a bit clearer on what is what!

I am inclined to shove it all under the bed and go with a tried and tested method - a generator system! I might go out this afternoon and look at some in the flesh.

[Teapot1]

Hi Ron,
AFAIK the vulcan is Elecro's heater, not the same as the Quantum which is a hybrid UV.
Yes all costs money which is why I recommend a speed controller for your pump, without seeing your pool you would save around 75% of the electricty and slower filtration is better filtration, the more you capture the better the water and the savings pay for other bits.

[RonPace]

I refer to this - they call it Vulcan but it well describes the technology that you favour:https://www.azialo.com/338-2450-traitement-uv-pro-pool-plus-vulcan.html#/339-modele-110_w_jusqu_a_100m3/341-pompe_doseuse_incluse-non

A speed controller to slow the pump down? I thought it should be the other way around: speed up the flow through the pump in order to turn over as much water as possible, no?

[Teapot1]

Hi Ron,
I see, so Elecro market the Quantum in the EU as the Vulcan! This is obvious as the schematic shows an Elecro heater in the diagram. So it is the same unit.

Well it depends on turnover. With a large pool like yours the size of your filter and plumbing will denote the flow you can get. What I have always done on customers pools is put my flow meter on the pipes to see what flow they actually have. From several years of doing this the general figure is half what the filter manufacturers actually state. My pool turns over 4 times per day (24 hours) this gives about the cleanest water you can get as skimmers only work when the system is running. Otherwise dirt just sinks after a while and then needs to be vacuumed out. Also I only need a flow of 6.6m3 per hour to achieve this as I have maximised the pools efficiency plumbing wise. I achieve 6.6m3 using around 65 watts of electricity per hour and a system pressure of 0.5 PSI. Running with a higher pressure is just dynamic head and friction which servs no purpose other than burning extra electricity.
Depending on the size of your filter, plumbing and pump you would need an hourly turnover of 16.66m3.
Setting your system to do this could save a lot of money. I set up a pool in the Dordogne of about 120m3 and that runs very well on 124 watts of electricity per hour, prior to that the owner was burning through about 2800 watts so in 24 hours he now uses about the same as his old system did in an hour and a quarter big big saving. Also the slower flow gives better filtration. Like a chef who wants a clear consomme its allowed to filter slowly, give the muslin a squeeze and it will go quicker but cloudy.
Each turnover you want to remove the maximum amount of dirt you can.