pump issues?

[Mrbobcat]

Hello! First time posting here. I have a small older in ground pool that was already at the house I bought about 1.5 years ago. It has a Hayward sand filter and 1hp pump and it has always used the Baquacil system. It is my first time having a pool and I had no idea how much work it would be. I cannot seem to find any pool places to help since I live in a fairly rural area about an hour from the bigger cities.

Anyway, I never had much of an issue until the last few weeks. My pump slowing quit working so I purchased a new Hayward pump online that was supposedly a direct replacement. I had a local handyman install it for me. Everything seemed to line up except one of the pipes going into it was a 2" instead of a 1.5". He got some other tubing and it leaked at first, but he put some silicone around it and tightened it back down and it seemed ok. But when we turned it on the pressure never went above 5psi and the old pump always ran between 10-12. I thought maybe it had to do with the new pump being more efficient. He said the motor did say 1.1hp, although it was advertised as 1hp. Another issue I notice right away is it is making a lot of foam in the pool, about 1/2 the pool has about an inch of foam on it now. I also noticed one side of the water intake jet (whatever it is called) does not have the force of the other side now. It had sat for about 2 weeks before I got the new pump so I thought the water may be bad, although it never got green. I took a sample to the pool place and they said the ph and alkalinity were both low, the oxidizer was low, but the algicide was high. I put the chemicals in they suggested, but no real change. The water is actually cloudier than usual now, but still has a blue tint to it. My best guess is there may be a leak somewhere in the pipes, but I can't seem to find anything around the pump. I'm not sure how to look though. I tried spraying some water around the fittings looking for air bubbles, but didn't see anything.

One last note, the handyman noticed that the new pump did have a few pieces of broken plastic when he took the end piece off to attach the electronics. It looked like it came from a bracket holding something, possibly the capacitor? We didn't think it was an issue since everything else looked ok. I'm now thinking it may have been dropped and maybe made a crack somewhere. I really hate to send it back as he charged me $125 to install it and I paid almost $800 for the pump which I haven't even made a payment on yet. Does anyone have any ideas? This is really got me aggravated and even has thinking of filling the thing in or selling the house, but know that is most likely foolish over just a pool!

[Teapot1]

Pump is new, any issues (broken plastic) send it back or you are bound to face problems later.
What size pool, what size filter? Pressure has nothing to do with how well the system works. My pump runs at 0.5psi and does a great job as it has for 16 years. Slower filtration is better filtration and saves electricity. Big pumps are fitted by men over compensating for their manhoods!
Bacacrap we call it in the industry, total expense and nothing to really show for it, sorry no help there but ditch it and go to chlorine.

[Mrbobcat]

The pool is only about 8' wide by 20' long and 5' deep. I have no idea the filter size, but you are supposed to put 3 bags of sand in it. The thing is it is barely sucking water in the skimmer at the side of the pool. I left the pump running all night by mistake, but there was nothing in the basket this morning. There were lots of bugs along the side and bottom of the pool like most days when it's not even running overnight. The water looks worse it ever has now too. It's not green, but it is very cloudy and thick if that's the right term. The whole pool had a layer of foam today too. I really don't want to send the pump back as it would be at least another $200 for the handyman to uninstall it and put another one in and it took a week to get him to drive down last time because he is not close. Plus I bought it on Amazon so I'm not sure what their return policy is. I would most likely have to pay shipping and I don't think there are any UPS places around my area. Maybe I should just close it up and worry about it in the Spring since it just got cold here and is not supposed to get above the mid 60's this week? I really don't want to close it with the water in its current condition though. Maybe I should call around some other pool places. There is no one very close by, but I would think somebody would be willing to drive a bit to look at it if I paid them. But then again if it is the pump then that would be wasted money too. IDK, after more research, it really sounds like air is getting in somewhere. I was going to try to reseat the gasket on the strainer lid of the pump, but I don't know how to do it without ruining it since it is pushed down in the grove pretty good. I did order another one when I ordered the pump though so I guess it's worth a try.

[Teapot1]

Sand filter, just need the diameter but 3 bags of sand suggests 18"-20" diameter which would not need a 1.5hp pump to function well. More later as busy now.

[Denniswiseman]

Maybe some images indicating where the leaking join was
Does the pump pre-filter basket have a lot of air in it?
Try lubricating the pump basket "O" ring with silicon grease. Purchase from eBay

[Teapot1]

I am pretty sure the air leak will be where the local handyman had to alter pipe work to suit the 1.5" pipe to the 2" fitting using silicone which probably wont hold against eithe the vacuum on the way in or the pressure on the way out. There are proper glued fittings for this so it sounds like a bodge. Your pump at 1hp is roughly twice the size it needs to be (0.5hp) would be fine. If you are worried abot cost you'll save it back in reduced electricity consumption, also slower filtration is better filtration. Bacacrap is twice the price of chlorine so you could make bigger savings their also. Chlorine does a better job as well. You need to sort your air leak one way or another and fitting a smaller pump with smaller fittings would be my starting point

[Mrbobcat]

Thanks for the advice teacup. I thought that the area which was leaking at first where he had to alter the pipe may be the issue too. But that silicone looks to have hardened pretty good. I tried spraying water around it and also tried shaving cream and didn't see any bubbles, but then again it could be seeping in and not out. The previous owner already had everything set up and it appears that old hayward pump was probably 5-10 years old rough guess and it worked for him. I figured the new one would be more efficient. I almost went with another brand that was on sale which was a 1.5hp. Glad I didn't. I didn't even think about getting less hp. I wonder if it is hard to convert over to chlorine? I did hear it was much cheaper. The 3 bottles of the Baquacil system cost me nearly $250 every Spring and I try to make it thru the season without buying more, but usually have to get another bottle of the Algicide at least. I do hear it's supposed to be gentler on the skin though. Forgot to add I did skimp a little on the sand this year too, I only had about 2.5 bags to put in it at the time and never added more. I didn't think it would be that big of a deal, but maybe the new pump didn't like it or something. But I'm pretty sure its most likely a leak somewhere.

BTW, it does look like I could send the pump back without charge within 30 days. Maybe I should and shut it down for the season and then decide what to get in the Spring. The thing is I don't really want to mess with the pipes if I don't have to. I heard something about you are supposed to calculate the right hp for the amount of water in the pool and the grade of the pipes, ect. and I just wanted to leave everything the way it was and replace the pump if possible because the unit is in my garage and the pipes go into the concrete under the garage and under the concrete patio into the pool somewhere. I hate to think what kind of a job it would be if some of those pipes go bad.

[Mrbobcat]

In case anyone is interested or has suggestions I'm still trying to decide what to do. I contacted at least a half dozen of the pool repair places in the city that I could find and the ones that replied back either said they were not taking new customers or don't have the staff at the moment. So I called the local place again to see if they would do a service call and when I explained my issue to her she said it sounded like it may be a filter issue and when I told her how much sand I put in it, she said it most likely was not near enough. She suggested I either add more sand and try it again or close the pool for the winter and fill it up properly in the Spring.

IDK, I guess it could be a coincidence that it stopped working correctly when I put the new pump in for some reason so it may be worth a try. She said my filter should have 200 pounds of sand in it. I don't remember exactly how much I put in it this year, but I think I was about a 1/2 bag short and I thought I was only supposed to put 3 bags in it because that is what the previous owner told me. I think the bags are usually 50 pounds so it could be way below what they recommend. Do you think it would do any good to add a bag now and see what it does or just wait until Spring since I will have to suck out the old sand anyway and it would be a waste of money to add a bag just to see if it will work? But then again if that is not the issue and I wait until Spring, it would be too late to return the pump if that ended up being the cause. Another thing to consider is if it would be ok to let the water sit for the next 6 months or so in its current condition? Its not awful, but it is not the greatest either. Its still a decent color, but like I said there is a lot of debri floating in it since it is not filtering very well. She suggested I take them another water sample to see what it needs for closing conditions, but if it is not filtering good enough, would it even mix well enough? I guess I could stir it with my hand skimmer the best I can if nothing else. Or I could always drain it in the Spring and start fresh. I know that would be a little pricey, but then again I would save on buying more chemicals now and maybe it would do it good to get fresh water in it since I don't know how many years the current water has been in it. Plus I could get in it and try to get some of the grime off the sides of the walls if possible too.

[Denniswiseman]

Maybe some images indicating where the leaking join was
Does the pump pre-filter basket have a lot of air in it?
Try lubricating the pump basket "O" ring with silicon grease. Purchase from eBay

Stop worrying about other things, your problem is It seems you are sucking in air and seeing as it worked previously it's obviously the new pump or the fitting of, not the amount of sand in your filter, which would only cause poor filtration and in fact would give a better flow

[Mrbobcat]

Dang, I already tried adding some sand. It actually was about 3/4 full, not sure how many pounds though. Since I had it opened, I added about 1/2 the bag I bought. But no real change except the psi is at about 6 now and the foam seems to be collecting on one side instead of the whole pool like it was yesterday. A couple things I noticed that may not be important is the filter was full of water until I sucked some out and the fitting that secures the controls on top of the sand filter is rusted on one side so I can't tighten it on that side any more, but it does seem to be sealing pretty good. I may call that lady back from the pool place, but the last thing I really want to do is send the pump back. I just remembered it does have a 1 year warranty so I could still send it back in the Spring. I would just have to pay shipping and most likely send it to the manufacturer instead of Amazon. Another thought is I still have the old pump which probably just needs a new motor and a 1.5 fitting instead of the 2.0 of course. IDK, my family thinks I should just close it up for the season and worry about it in the Spring. I also need to get my fence fixed from some damage during a wind storm early in the Season. I can't seem to find anybody that wants to work on that either. I had three fence places come out and give me a quote. They all put me off until around October, but they are not replying back when I try to contact them now. All I need is two posts put in and hardware to attach the panel that came off. But it appears the bottoms are concreted in and I don't think they want to mess with it because it is right next to the house and the concrete patio. The whole pool thing has me very discouraged at this point.

[Mrbobcat]

Update: I think I found the issue! I just checked the pump again and noticed a little bit of water around the top of the pump where we had the leak before the handyman took the fitting out and applied some silicone. Its not a lot, but I'm thinking it may be enough to be causing the issues with all the pressure they produce. I'll try to upload a photo if I can get my old phone to work with the computer. I have no idea how to fix it myself though as I'm not good with these types of things. He ended up putting two clamps on it and I tried tightening them a little more, but don't want to break something. I'm thinking my best bet is try to find a local plumber. Never mind the picture as I can't figure out how to upload it on this site.

[Teapot1]

Sounds like some progress, keep us updated but whatever you decide going forwards you still do not need a 1.5hp pump on that size of setup so going smaller will improve filtration and therefore water quality, save around 50% of the electricity so you'll recoup the costs you have spent this far in a season.

[Denniswiseman]

If you have email, send it to your PC
Where you write a post
Click Full Editor & Preview
Click Attachments
Click Add Files or you can drag and drop
Alternatively send it to one of the picture sites (Drop Box) and post the link here

If the leak is on the pressure side, then it won't suck air in. Air will only come in from the suction side

[Mrbobcat]

Sounds like some progress, keep us updated but whatever you decide going forwards you still do not need a 1.5hp pump on that size of setup so going smaller will improve filtration and therefore water quality, save around 50% of the electricity so you'll recoup the costs you have spent this far in a season.

Like I said, I ended up going with another 1hp replacement pump. I still don't know what to do at this point. I can't get any pool repair places to come out to my house. I did find one plumber that may be willing to look at it. But I just checked and I don't see any leaking right now so not sure if replacing that inlet pipe would actually help or not?

[Mrbobcat]

If you have email, send it to your PC
Where you write a post
Click Full Editor & Preview
Click Attachments
Click Add Files or you can drag and drop
Alternatively send it to one of the picture sites (Drop Box) and post the link here

If the leak is on the pressure side, then it won't suck air in. Air will only come in from the suction side

I'm not sure I follow as far as the pressure side. I believe the issue is the pipe going from the filter to the top of the pump, which I believe would make it the suction side if I'm not mistaken? BTW, I tried your advice on uploading a pic if that will help, but it is saying the file is too large.