PLumbing from pressure to suction many problems!

Karma · Postby **Karma** » Fri 27 Aug, 2010 18:57

Brief story on our pool:

We just bought the home 3 weeks ago. During the inspection process the pool and hot tube were working fine. We were told from our inspector & realtor that we should have the pool switched from a pressure to a suction system. We did some research and it sounded like a great idea. We hired a great company to do the re-plumbing, and had them install a hayward cleaner. Two days later (we live in AZ..300 degrees during the summer) we decided to turn on the hot tube so the kids could see it work, and that is when the problems started. When we turned on the spa jets all 6 turned on, and then slowly they all stopped working except for one of the jets, and truly that isn't doing much either. We applied a year warranty to the pool and hottube when we bought the home, and because it was just fine before we bought it we were able to have the warranty company come out and look at everything. They looked at the pump, the filters, jets and plumbing and could not find out what the problem was. They first tried to say it was bad filters, which is wasn't, then they tried to say that all jets were broke (god knows how that would happen in 2 days of if working perfect) which we concluded it wasn't the issue.

my questions is could it be the plumbing. Three different pool people have come out to look and none of the companies were the ones that installed the plumbing, and they said that the plumbing looks fine, but I feel if everything was working well when it was a pressure system and then we switched to a suction and the hot tube jets just quite that it could possible be all plumbing related.

We are witts end. Please help!!!

lbridges · Postby **lbridges** » Fri 27 Aug, 2010 20:11

You're probably going to have to post show photos, and it would be helpful if you could point out which pipes changed.

For example, if you deleted the pressure side cleaning line, how was that capped off (could be losing pressure here if it's leaking), or is there a valve that could be trying reroute the water incorrectly - can't tell without pictures.

Postby **Pool Clown** » Sat 28 Aug, 2010 15:37

Do the jets run off the filter pump? Or do they have a separate pump?

If they run off the filter pump, then it could be the filter(s).

As the filter(s) get dirty, the flow to the jets decrease. Your jets require a certain amount of flow to "pull" the air into the jet creating the action. If it worked fine then slowly one by one stopped working, it could be the filter element slowly reducing the flow due to age. Your symptom describes a filter that could be nearing the end of its usable life.

The symptom is: Pressure on the filter is high. You clean the filter to reduce the pressure, and increase the flow, but the filter seems to climb up to that high "clean me" pressure within a week or so. If this is happening to yours, it could be time for a new filter element.

X357X · Postby **X357X** » Sun 29 Aug, 2010 01:14

the pool and hot tub were working fine.

If it was working fine, then you should have left it alone.

We were told from our inspector & realtor that we should have the pool switched from a pressure to a suction system.

Why would you listen to a Realtor and a home inspector? What do they know about pools?

We hired a great company to do the re-plumbing, and had them install a Hayward cleaner.

Why aren't they out there helping you with this?

Karma · Postby **Karma** » Sun 29 Aug, 2010 11:53

The reason that we changed from a pressure to suction is because we were told pressure systems were awful. We didn't just listen to our realtor and inspector, we also did research of our own, and had a few different companies come out and they also pointed out that we had a pressure system and should really look into a suction system without us even mentioning anything.

We have had our filters checked several times by several different pool companies and they all say the same thing, they are in very good condition and clean, so that isn't it either.

The jets work off one filter pump. Again the filters are in good condition per each pool person. The pool people that we have had come out all states the plumbing was installed correctly.

The jets didn't stop working slowly, they stopped working completely one day. Thursday they were working, Friday they weren't.

The individual that installed the plumbing has come out on several occasions and pulled things apart and put them back together not knowing what is going on, which again leaves everyone stumped.

I have tried to call the pool company that built both the pool and hottube, and they never call back, which is just wonderful.

I think that we should go back to the pressure system, but I am afraid to spend any more money to have it switched back and find out that they still don't work.

What is the cost at having the jets taken apart again? Should we flush out the tubes in the junction box?

I have been told by each pool person that this isn't going to cause damage to our pool or hottube, but I don't know what to believe because I am afraid that if there is pressure somewhere that is stuck it will burst a pipe.

I will post pictures soon.

Karma · Postby **Karma** » Sun 29 Aug, 2010 13:23

My husband create a quick mini webpage of pictures.

http://www.socialkarmamedia.com//new%20 ... areaz.html

James Watson · Postby **James Watson** » Sun 29 Aug, 2010 15:59

Oh we found something in the filters as well a cylinder with blue, white and green beads in it.....of course no pool guy has ever heard anything about this contraption.

Probably a SmartPure Mineral Cartridge, which contains copper and silver. Copper and silver are not good to use. You should not use that.
http://shop.bluehaven.com/product/smart ... l-supplies

The system looks pretty convoluted. Although, I am surprised that pool people coming out to the job site are not able to figure it out.

Karma · Postby **Karma** » Sun 29 Aug, 2010 18:08

James THANK YOU =))) We had no idea what that cartridge was. Now a even bigger concern; why didn't any of the pool companies know what that was. If you could find it that quick how in gods green earth couldn't they figure it out. We took it out a few weeks ago when we made one of the pool guys check the filters so that they would quit blaming the hot tub on bad filters.

What do you think of the system? Does it look right???

My husband drained the hot tub today and turned on the jets and there was water coming out of all of them, but only one of the jets had the correct pressure....

James Watson · Postby **James Watson** » Sun 29 Aug, 2010 21:27

It appears that they connected to suction cleaner to your spa suction line. I'm not sure why they did that. I would think that it would be connected to the pool suction line.

Perhaps a few more pictures would help. Your system is pretty complex. It will probably require someone to come out to the jobsite to figure this out.

Does the hot tub have a blower?

Karma · Postby **Karma** » Sun 29 Aug, 2010 21:36

What other pictures do you need so that I can get them for you?

James Watson · Postby **James Watson** » Sun 29 Aug, 2010 21:49

The pictures that you have provided are very helpful. Perhaps a few more overview picture would help. Although, I think that this is going to require a visit from a good service technician.

lbridges · Postby **lbridges** » Mon 30 Aug, 2010 19:33

James Watson wrote:It appears that they connected to suction cleaner to your spa suction line. I'm not sure why they did that. I would think that it would be connected to the pool suction line...

That is a confusing bit that I don't get either. Without an explanation I would say you shouldn't re-employ that person.

I don't see how that causes more of a problem than water levels though.

Since the change from the pressure line to suction line seems to be the only change, my bet is on something in the junk they threw into the filter system has blocked off a line, probably flowing out until the lines at the spa got small enough to block them off.

If the spa is shut off is the pool flow about right?

Postby **Pool Clown** » Sat 18 Sep, 2010 01:53

I'm looking at the "after plumbing nightmare" pic...

I agree with Jim Watson, the line at the bottom of the pic should have been plumbed into the pool side. It will work like this, it's just one more valve you have to turn when switching over to run in spa mode, thats all.

The water travels out of the pump thru the vertical pipe, up over and down to the bottom fitting of the filter where it enters the filter. Then out thru the upper fitting on the filter and then goes down into the ground, over to the heater, then back over to the rear of the pad where it goes thru the Chlorine generator cell (which has been removed and plugged). Now all water goes thru the by-pass, which by the way could be your problem cuz that by-pass looks like it's only a 1" line in 2 places. Anyway, the water then goes back into the ground to pop up again at the front of the pad (just to the left of the red "sprays" valve) up to the Jandy valve where it splits, pool or spa. Spa to the right, thru a check valve, then on to the spa. To the left it goes to the pool (near), and it looks like the other goes to a water feature (far) thru another check valve.

Put the valves in the position to run the jets, and take a pic and post, lets see if you got all the valve handles in the correct positions.