FLOC ISN'T WORKING

Algae problems in swimming pool water.
Green (cloudy) water or slimy pool walls.
Black algae. Mustard algae. Pink or white pool mold.
Bunny123

FLOC ISN'T WORKING

Postby Bunny123 » Mon 25 Jun, 2007 05:24

Okay I am at my wits end. I have been working with my pool stores to try and get the algae out of my water. I added conditioner/stabilizer. I shocked my pool 5 times. Got my chlorine up. All of my other readings were looking good. I vaccumed and brushed brushed brushed! I added alaecide. Added phosfloc yesterday at noon. Now it is 5:30am and the top of my pool is still a slimmy green. Nothing has settled that I can see. I followed the directions for the floc to a T. What is going on? Why didn't anything settle to the bottom yet? I need some help BAD.
Thank you.


chem geek
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Postby chem geek » Mon 25 Jun, 2007 11:13

I suspect that your Free Chlorine (FC) levels are not high enough at your Cyanuric Acid (CYA) level to kill the algae much faster than it is reproducing. Can you post a full set of water chemistry numbers -- especially FC and CYA levels (pH would be good as well)? Calcium Hardness (CH) and Total Alkalinity (TA) are not relevant for getting rid of algae, but they would be good to know to understand your pool -- cloudiness can occur if these are out of balance, independent of algae.
to Bunny123

algae

Postby to Bunny123 » Mon 25 Jun, 2007 14:24

I had a similar problem and learned that I had a very high level of phosphates in the water. Those high levels come from nearby trees. High levels of phosphates allow algae to grow even in well balanced water. A pool store can check your phosphate levels. The cure is a specific chemical that you add to the skimmer basket as the pump runs. The chemical then creates a layer in the filter that collects the phosphates. You run the filter for 48 hours straight and then backwash the phoshates out. Hope this helps.
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Re: FLOC ISN'T WORKING

Postby Backglass » Mon 25 Jun, 2007 15:46

Bunny123 wrote:Okay I am at my wits end. I have been working with my pool stores to try and get the algae out of my water. I added conditioner/stabilizer. I shocked my pool 5 times. Got my chlorine up. All of my other readings were looking good. I vaccumed and brushed brushed brushed! I added alaecide. Added phosfloc yesterday at noon. Now it is 5:30am and the top of my pool is still a slimmy green. Nothing has settled that I can see. I followed the directions for the floc to a T. What is going on? Why didn't anything settle to the bottom yet? I need some help BAD.
Thank you.


Floc doesn't kill algae. It just coagulates the tiny particles in the water so they can settle out or be filtered. It's the last step after everything else is fixed. That being said, Floc takes 24-48 hours to settle out with the pump OFF. Until it settles it looks as if nothing is happening, then it seems to settle out all at once. If it hasn't been 24 hours, keep the pump off and wait (assuming the algae is actually dead of course!).
paperlade1

floc/algae

Postby paperlade1 » Mon 25 Jun, 2007 18:05

I'm having a very similar problem. Pool was extremely green. I kept the chlorine levels high for days and it seemed to clear it up. I've taken samples to store, they tell me everything is perfect. Pool is SOOOOOOOOOO very cloudy. Beginning of last week I went in to get floc, they sold me some enzyme thing that's supposed to eat all the particles and you don't have to backwash. I did two applications, two days apart, using the whole bottle as was suggested. Friday I shocked again, as pool was starting to get a green tint again. Saturday I used a liquid floc (which i've only ever used the granuals.) Tonight, pool is still cloudy, didn't settle in the least little bit. I've also noticed that my chlorine levels just won't seem to stay in the normal range. I'm guessing this is because maybe there's still live algae that I can't see???? Please help! I really want to see the bottom of my pool :D
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Postby Buggsw » Mon 25 Jun, 2007 23:09

It's a little hard to help when you don't give us more information like your pool volume, test readings (a full set), what type of pool, what type of filter.

You've thrown a lot of "stuff" in your pool. Floc & clarifier are something that I only recommend as a last resort. Trying to use something that blasts the particles so small so you don't have to backwash is sort of contrary to what you use Floc & clarifier for. I just can't imagine what that product must be.

So get us the information we need and we can better tell you what you need to do.

Pool Volume in gallons
Pool Type as in vinyl, plaster, fiberglass
Filter type as in Sand, DE, Cartridge
Total Chlorine
Free Chlorine
pH
Total Alkalinity
Calcium Hardness
CYA - stabilizer
bunny123

Postby bunny123 » Tue 26 Jun, 2007 06:10

my pool is an above ground 18ft across round 4 ft deep. approx 7,500 gallons. Vinyl lining. Sand filter. Changed sand about a week ago.
Last weekend I had the store test my water. These are some of the readings:
Free Chlorine 0.3 (Low)
Total Chlorine 1.6 (ok)
ph 7.8 (high)
Cyanuric Acid 10 (Low)
Copper 0 (ok)

They had me add a conditioner - stabilizer (full bottle)
I shocked it 5 times and got the chlorine level up to a good reading (tested with a test strip)
I vaccumed and brushed a few times.
I added algaecide and then added the phosfloc. This afternoon it will be 48 hours. I can see down about 12-20 inches but still looks pretty bad.
What should I do??? I have been spending a fortune and have yet used it in 2 months.
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Postby Backglass » Tue 26 Jun, 2007 09:57

bunny123 wrote:What should I do??? I have been spending a fortune and have yet used it in 2 months.


You should do this following in order:

* - Recheck your CYA level. With a level of 10, no matter how much chlorine you add it will all disappear in a few hours thanks to the sun. You want a level of 30-50. It's sunscreen for your chlorine.

* - Shock your pool to a chlorine level of 10. Keep it there for at least 24 hours.

* - Run your pump and filter 24-7

* - Keep brushing to make sure everything is killed by the above.

* - Wait. Only after you have done the above will your filter start to clear the water and this could take a week.

Chlorine is your friend, but it has to be present 24/7.

Good luck!
bunny123

Postby bunny123 » Tue 26 Jun, 2007 21:18

I came home from work and it looked as though alot had settled. I vacuumed up as much as I could. I noticed alot of algae on the sides so after I vacuumed I brushed the sides and added more water to my pool. Will everything that I brushed off of the sides settle again so I can vacuum it up? I still do not have my filter on allowing everything to settle again? When is it safe to shock? Obviously I do not have my filter running in order to let the floc work so I figured adding more shock at this point will not circulate.

Thanks for your help!
bunny123

Postby bunny123 » Fri 29 Jun, 2007 05:57

I am still working on getting my pool clear. I got rid of most of the algae I believe. All of my levels are good now. I continue to keep the chlorine levels up. Scrub and vacuum daily. Water is still very cloudy. I can not see the bottom. I keep using a clarifier as well. What should I do?
Backglass
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Postby Backglass » Fri 29 Jun, 2007 08:49

bunny123 wrote:I am still working on getting my pool clear. I got rid of most of the algae I believe. All of my levels are good now. I continue to keep the chlorine levels up. Scrub and vacuum daily. Water is still very cloudy. I can not see the bottom. I keep using a clarifier as well. What should I do?


Assuming that all your number are in line, it just takes time and continuous chlorine with thew filter running 24/7.

Post your latest test numbers so we can be sure.
pk4217
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Postby pk4217 » Mon 02 Jul, 2007 08:39

bunny123 wrote:These are some of the readings:
Free Chlorine 0.3 (Low)
Total Chlorine 1.6 (ok)
ph 7.8 (high)
Cyanuric Acid 10 (Low)
Copper 0 (ok)


if the comments in brackets came from the pool store, you better stay away from them. Total Chlorine > Free Chlorine means you've a Combined Chlorine (here = 1.6 - 0.3 = 1.3), and it's not a good result. you'll need to shock at least 10 times higher than the Combined Chlorine.

I would suggest you get yourself a decent test kit, Taylor K-2006 is a good start.
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Re: FLOC ISN'T WORKING

Postby AusFastLife » Thu 10 Mar, 2022 19:19

This is a really useful discussion for anyone having this problem, so even though the original post was from 2007 (15 years ago for me) I just wanted to add my experience with this.

I have a 40,000L (~10,500 gallons) inground concrete pool, lines with pebblecrete. The back of our property is a big reserve which slopes down to our house. Every time it rains all the run off from the reserve comes through our yard and if it is heavy enough into our pool. So every time it rains we get a fierce algal bloom. This year has been full on El Nina here in Sydney Australia.

When the rain is really heavy it fills the pool up to overflowing and the water turns a thick murky brown (not just green from algae). I found that when the water gets to its highest point it seems to wash tannins from the soil into the pool turning it brown. When it is that dark you can't see the green form the algae, but the algae is there too.

So I have a lot of experience in clearing extremely heavily loaded pool water. I wanted to make a couple of notes here about the types of issues others have been posting in this discussion, and also describe the problem I am currently having, which is what brought me here.

1) Alot of folks describe how they have shocked and flocked and their pool is still green. Others have asked what your pool numbers are. Remember the only thing that matters in clearing your pool is Free Chlorine. All the other parameters are all about optimising the conditions for free chlorine to exist and to do its job. When you shock your pool you are pouring an excess of chlorine into your pool to get free chrlorine levels up above 30 PPM.

If you have a very large pool with a very high load of organic matter, you are likely going to need ALOT of chlorine. The chlorine will interact with organic matter in the pool as soon as your pour it in. This will bind up all the free chlorine preventing your free chlorine levels from reaching as high as you need. In a heavily affected pool you can add the recommended amount of chlorine to shock the pool, and effectively still have no free chlorine as soon as you treated it since the free chlorine has been bound up. To shock a pool you need to keep adding chlorine until free chlorine is above 30 PPM. This will kill everything.

If there is no free chlorine, and there is algae left, algal growth will always re-populate your pool. Remember the growth rate is exponential, the more algae there is the faster it generatres more algae. If you have Cyanuric acid in your pool higher than 50PPM it will also bind up your free chlorine and make it difficult to shock your pool. It is best to use unstabilised chlorine when shocking your pool because of how much you have to add.

2) My suggestion for folks who's flocking isn't working is you are not shocking your pool hard enough. All of your free chlorine is being used up by the organic load in your pool so your chlorine levels are not getting high enough to shock the pool.

3) My brown water is from the tannins. Flocking does not get rid of that. I have to shock to bleach it out. That lets me see the turbidity from the algae. I need to completely kill the algae before flocking. If there is any algae left the water will remain murky as the flock gets used up and can't bind up all the particles that are generated as more algae reproduces. Normally one 15L of 125g/L Bleach is enough to shock my pool. But I think my organic load is so high at the moment I will need 30L. My pH is going to be messed up so I will need to correct it after the bleach has had a chance to circulate for about an hour. I have a tonne of trees over the back of my house so I think my phosphates will be high so I will add some anti-phosphate to bring that down.

(I tend to add treatments based on symptoms since I buy my pool chemicals from Bunnings a big hardware store chain that sells the chemicals but does not do testing, stores that do proper testing sell the chemicals but they are very expensive. I feel bad going to the pool stores to get testing done, only to then go to a cheaper store to buy the stuff.)
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Re: FLOC ISN'T WORKING

Postby Teapot1 » Sat 12 Mar, 2022 08:00

Why haven't you built a soak away to take away the run off water before it gets into your pool?

It isn't just the free chlorine level that matters, the cyanuric acid (CYA) ratio to free chlorine is what needs to be correct to shock a pool. The free chlorine level needs to be 40% of the CYA. 50ppm cya x 40% = 20ppm of chlorine.
100ppm of cya x 40% = 40ppm of chlorine.

Your pH will only be high temporarily so leave it alone and it will come back down again as the shock chlorine level comes back down otherwise youll need to add pH up to bring it back again which is pointless.

Of course this has nothing to do with using floc corectly.
I may not give you the answer you want to hear, but I will give an honest opinion of your situation as you decribe it.
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Re: FLOC ISN'T WORKING

Postby Chrismfitz » Sun 24 Jul, 2022 11:53

I had 15, 17 year olds in our pool last week. The pool was cloudy with a lot of "stuff" floating around. I put in close to a liter of floc. It has been over 24 hours and there a many green floating islands on the top of the pool. Will they eventually sink or should I manually skim them off the top? thanks

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