Stone Problems

[dmc123]

Hi
I just got a house with a pool and I quickly learn about the chemistry and maintaince. I thought things were going well until I started noticing that the Arizona slate decking was starting to spall and dust. SOmetimes large peices delaminate from it. I reading that since Im using a SWG its probably whats causing it. Besides changing all the sandstone coping and the slate decking what are my options.
If I wanted to convert to a cholrine system and remove the salt do I need to drain the entire pool. Is there some way to get the salt out of solution and vacumm it??? I

thanks

[czechmate]

Slate is very commonly used as a coping or adjacent to a clasical coping to form a cooldeck.
Slate comes from different regions and are sometimes very different in their endurance to the element. Some types will absorb moisture, which in a winter months freeze and disturb the inner layers and integrity of the stone. Later in the summer months, the heat expansion and contraction at night slowly work to cause peeling of layers of the stone.
The only protection is to seal the stone in the regions where freeze is common.
Good quality of dense slate is often used for a waterline tile, so it merely depends on stone quality and the weather elements, how the slate will behave in pool surrounding.
Much more then being exposed to chlorine residue and other pool chemicals.

[dmc123]

Thanks. I was looking for some specifics to help my situation. How to seal with what? How to convert back to clhorine. Do I have to drain the pool?

[czechmate]

I keep 2500ppm of salt in my regular chlorine pool. It is beneficial to skin and does help a little bit with my CSI. I like it, the water feels better and it did not ever give me any problems on deck or on the travertine coping.
Of course we do not canonball daily and I do not allow wasting treated water any similar way.
One more thing. I do not see a sandstone being any more resistant to outdoor elements than a slate would be.

[cpo2go]

If you're concerned about the salinity of the water, the fastest way to take care of that is to drain it. It's not necessary to drain it to "convert" to a regular chlorine pool, though.
A good sealant that I've used in similar situations is made by Deck-O-Seal and I believe it's just called "Stone Sealer" or something that is pretty self explanatory. It goes on very easily and I would recommend re-applying it on a yearly basis. That may not be what they recommend but I definitely wouldn't go longer than 18 months between applications.

[dmc123]

Thanks Cpo2go
thats the specifics I was looking for. I was hoping that the salt could be consumed some other way like running the SWG at full for a perior of time. I had just gotten the water where I wanted it with conditioners and such.
The deck-o-seal is some expensive stuff huh? How can they justify that price? whats in there gold? lol

I guess I will need to drain ASAP but the kids will hate me for cutting the season short. Watching the stone dissapear before my eyes is keeping me from sleeping. Its horrible.

I love the salt feel but I cant afford to re-deck the pool to maintain the pool with salt.

OH well the joys of pool ownership

[czechmate]

Are you referring to Arizona flagstone? You can use a regular sealer for stone tile from Home Depot or Lowes. It is not cheap but it goes long ways.
It is mostly silicone based. Best is to apply it from a small sprayer bottle. You do not need to wipe it like from inside travertine tile, but do not overspray. It is beteer to do 2 light coats.
Do it when the deck is cool to give it a chance to penetrate into the stone.
Of course like anything else over time the destructive sun rays will eat it up. You probably will need to reapply every 2-3 years. Make sure you wash the stones day before and let dry out well.

[dmc123]

Thanks
The stone has more of a slate look but its red. Its made up of laminations of stones that can flake away in large peices.. Its not fun to watch.
The main problem is that I cant tell if its normal for this stone to degrade like this around a pool or if its due to the fact that I swithced it to salt (~2800 PPM) when I bought it 3 months ago.
If its due to the salt then I want the salt out. If it turns out its not the salt and just the traffic of the extra kid using the pool then Im throwing money in the trash by draining the pool (water and all the conditioners etc.)
Ugggg

[czechmate]

You have an Arizona flagstone. It is prized for its color and thickness. Being a lot thinner than regular flagstone, it contains lot more square feet per ton and cost up to 500.00 per ton, twice as the regular flagstone.
It is lot easier to lay, since the bed is more uniform and there is no need for constant adjustment to the thicker pieces. It is mostly used on concrete patios where it would be imposible to use variable thickness. That is what makes it expensive.
Arizona is a high quality stone and properly sealed should last a generation. But as always you can get a lemon. Get a stone guy out there to recomend a remedy. I would not drain the pool.
The vicinity of a salt water with salinity which is less than 1/10 of a sea water should not be a factor!

[dmc123]

OK IM looking for someone who knows both pools and stone...its not easy to find. I surprised you dont think that the salt in the water does not contribute since the internet is riddled with people with stone issues in the vicinity of a salt water pool. Im reading that a lot of pool builders are not even giving warrantys when the pool goes salt.
Im trying to enjoys this pool but its been one thing after another since I got the house.
Now you cant even walk on the deck without your feet turning red from the stone

[cpo2go]

You're right about the salt water contributing to the deterioration of the stone. Admittedly, I'm not a "stone guy" but I have been taking care of swimming pools for years and I've seen it first hand. My salt pools with stone decks and/or coping have all needed to be sealed. They definitely take a beating from everything they are exposed to but, from what I've seen, you can solve the problem by sealing the stone. I've done it with success. I guess they can charge what they do because it's cheaper than the alternatives

Maybe the other sealers are cheaper, I've never checked. The Deck-O-Seal works for me and my customers so I stick with it.

On more than one occasion I've heard the manufacturers of the salt chlorine generators mention the degradation of stone and it has been written about in many industry trade magazines. The real question is that, outside the US, the pools in Europe and Australia are almost exclusively salt so, do they have these problems and, if so, how are they treating them? I wish I knew.

[dmc123]

I leaning towards comcluding its the salt. Im very dissapointed I loved it. It turns out the stone is a red indian slate. Its gotten really bad now.
In the 2 months weve been using the pool I think the deck is destroyed. Ugg. Ive had 2 stone restoration guys come and they really dont know what to do with it. One want to strip and seal with Americrete 1325 for 4500 for 800 square with no promises. The other wont touch it. Im sick of this pool.
Its making me regret I bought the rest of this great house.

[dmc123]

I leaning towards concluding its the salt. Im very dissapointed I loved it. It turns out the stone is a red indian slate. Its gotten really bad now.
In the 2 months we've been using the pool I think the deck is destroyed. Ugg. Ive had 2 stone restoration guys come and they really dont know what to do with it. One want to strip and seal with Americrete 1325 for 4500 for 800 square with no promises. The other wont touch it. Im sick of this pool.

Its so difficult to figure out what to do. Half the people say its salt and the others dont think so. Many people think that I should use a top coat sealer and the other half say penetrating sealer. This is a real pain.