Blue Green Suspension during Winterizing

Causes and cures for cloudy swimming pool water.
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Ranger1
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Blue Green Suspension during Winterizing

Postby Ranger1 » Sun 20 Oct, 2024 19:42

New pool owner as of Sept 10th from house purchase. I think the previous owner used his gut feeling for dosing chemicals. I followed the winterization protocol provided by local pool company after they tested my water. Added 10 lb of Alkalinity Plus (sodium bicarbonate), no issues observed. Circulated for 4 hours, then added second 10 lb bag of Alkalinity Plus.... my pool instantly turned cloudy. I finished the rest of their procedure, adding 2 lb of sodium carbonate and 2 lb of 78% powder shock (pool life turbo shock) with their recommended cycle times in between doses. The clarification did not improve.

Below are the original numbers and the numbers AFTER their treatment. I removed my filter and found it was coated in a blue-green squishy material. The pool company does not know what it is and I do not know how to remove it. I have pics of the blue/green sludge but I am still learning how to upload them. You can squish it between your fingers and it easily washes off with water.

FC: 5.7, then 18.48
TC: 7.64, then 18.49
pH: 6.3 (lowest they can read), then 6.6
TA: 0, then 49
CH: 119, then 172
CYA: 201, then 193
Copper: 2.6, then 3.0
Phosphate: 7,043 then 2,112
Iron: 0.1, then 0.0

Pool: 11K gal in ground, fiberglass, pentair pump and filter
I am located in PA.


Ranger1
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My Pool: 10k gal fiberglass inground pool

Re: Blue Green Suspension during Winterizing

Postby Ranger1 » Mon 21 Oct, 2024 11:40

The culprit appears to be copper salts.
Denniswiseman
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Re: Blue Green Suspension during Winterizing

Postby Denniswiseman » Tue 22 Oct, 2024 02:36

Looking at your numbers everything seems well out of kilter

CYA is excessive
Excessive CYA renders your chlorine ineffective and you have to use more to get the same sanitation
For every 10 ppm Free Chlorine (FC) added by Trichlor, it also increases Cyanuric Acid (CYA) by 6 ppm.
For every 10 ppm FC added by Dichlor, it also increases CYA by 9 ppm.
For every 10 ppm FC added by Cal-Hypo, it also increases Calcium Hardness (CH) by at least 7 ppm
To reduce your CYA you have to do a partial drain and refill
Continuous use of Trichlor/Dichlor will raise your CYA which means you have to raise your chlorine level as well
Also you have combined chlorine and need to Slam (Shock Level and Maintain) with relation to Chlorine / CYA Chart and Recommended Pool Levels

Bearing in mind that you are winterizing I would be inclined to just drain down sufficiently and sort out completely in the spring as winter rains will dilute the CYA which does reduce over time

Use these common products to balance your pool
Liquid chlorine (sodium hypochlorite or plain bleach) Liquid chlorine only adds salt
Muriatic acid (hydrochloric acid) to lower pH and TA
Bicarbonate of soda to raise TA
Aeration will raise pH only
Soda ash will raise pH and TA

Your copper is caused by the use of algecide
Don't use copper algaecide as the effects aren't always desirable. Use a Polyquat 60
(Any brand as long as the ingredients are "Poly [oxyethylene (dimethyliminio) ethylene (dimethyliminio) ethylene dichloride" at 60% concentration.)

Test strips are commonly called guess strips
You really need to get yourself a decent FAS/DPD test kit (Taylor K2006c or TF Testkits TF100 in the states) to get accurate results as maintaining an appropiate shock level means testing quite often during the day and not just dumping shock in and thinking "that's it"

As you stated earlier it appears that the previous owner just dumped all the pool store products in causing a Yo-Yo effect

Hope this helps
Teapot1
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Re: Blue Green Suspension during Winterizing

Postby Teapot1 » Wed 23 Oct, 2024 04:41

Whilst I endorse most of what Dennis has said poloyquat algaecides are a waste of money, as its winter you could leave the copper for now and it will prevent algae in most cases then deal with it in the spring. No test kit for polyquat? No, because the pool industry is way to clever to let you monitor that level.
If leaving the copper, DO NOT let the pH go to more than 7.6 as copper can drop out of suspension and stain.
Cannot believe 0 for alkalinity originally so doubt they tests.
I may not give you the answer you want to hear, but I will give an honest opinion of your situation as you decribe it.
Ranger1
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My Pool: 10k gal fiberglass inground pool

Re: Blue Green Suspension during Winterizing

Postby Ranger1 » Fri 25 Oct, 2024 13:27

Thanks! My current goal is to remove the water via a no-drain water exchange since it is a fiberglass pool. I am attempting to remove the copper oxide and copper carbonate since it is covering everything in the pool. I am struggling a little bit to vacuum it up since it easily resuspends. Would a clarifier be useful in this instance?
Teapot1
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My Pool: 12000 gallons vinyl liner,

Re: Blue Green Suspension during Winterizing

Postby Teapot1 » Sat 26 Oct, 2024 02:36

You can use a clarifier, depending on what filtration you have. I commonly see a larger pump and a small filter configeration which is worse for trying to remove fine particles as slower filtration is better filtration.
Lowering the pH can often help as it can put the copper back into solution for filtering. Because copper is a metal it had a positive charge, if you use an anionic flocculent (negatively charged) correctly it will attract the positively charge copper and cause it to form clumps that are easier to remove. Some have success using Culater pads as well
I may not give you the answer you want to hear, but I will give an honest opinion of your situation as you decribe it.
Denniswiseman
Pool Industry Leader
Pool Industry Leader
Posts: 2616
Joined: Tue 06 Sep, 2011 05:48
My Pool: 10k inground fibreglass, Telescopic Cover, Hayward Powerline pump, Quality filter with glass media, 27kw output heat pump, K-2006C test kit
Location: United Kingdom

Re: Blue Green Suspension during Winterizing

Postby Denniswiseman » Sat 26 Oct, 2024 10:02

With a fibreglass pool you can still do a partial drain and refill without it floating so long as you know the water table
Vacuum to waste slowly will get rid of a lot without going through the filter

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