Just Purchased Project - Delaware

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mknmike
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Posts: 157
Joined: Fri 02 Jul, 2021 21:00

Just Purchased Project - Delaware

Postby mknmike » Tue 02 Aug, 2022 13:07

Teapot1 wrote:Pool paint is just a waste on money, you'll be doing it all over again in 2-3 years.
I havent listened to Pool Steve's video but having fitted liners to leaky pools the only issues are where fitting meant for concrete have to changed for liners.

Thank you!

It appears that the pool is holding water after 24 hours now with zero drop in the level so far.

The copper pipe in the hole below the dragon fountain thing appears like a drain. I don’t know what it’s purpose is, but for now, I stuffed a foam kids toy ball in the hole to help hold water. This way I will have a chance of letting the level get above just under half way up the tile. (I am keeping the drain in the corner I’ve pictured so many times plugged too).

Every day I go over there I will run the hose. Or a few minutes to raise the level and see how high the pool will hold water. I really think that grouting the tile was desperately needed. Look at these pictures my pool guy sent me and told me to patch.


https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/202208 ... 8526a.jpeg

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/202208 ... cb6f4.jpeg


[img]https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20220802/34d800d9ea9d808a08160909ba78526a.jpeg[/img]

[img]https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20220802/bc254f4c9dcc24b080cafdae1c3cb6f4.jpeg[/img]

And here’s how that area looks now.

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/202208 ... 22f191.jpg

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/202208 ... 33ea15.jpg

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/202208 ... b7af9f.jpg

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/202208 ... 859d23.jpg



[img]https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20220802/296512580227cf3a51de2d517022f191.jpg[/img]


[img]https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20220802/91cfb90c65930f3dc3ca85366333ea15.jpg[/img]
[img]https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20220802/4504d8c59704c2d28576d21875b7af9f.jpg[/img]
[img]https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20220802/741f8afcec33688a14736d38ac859d23.jpg[/img]


In any case, I’m not yet ready to pony up for anything major just yet.

It sounds like even a liner would require me to drain the pool and sandblast it to the point where paint chips aren’t flaking off. Even those seem like they’d be liable to rip a liner. And then there’s all the broken tile. So that means the tile would probably have to be removed too. Right? And so the coping. And next thing, it seems like I’d be redoing the entire pool just to get a liner in. Right?

My youngest is 10 years old. I suspect that this pool, even if painting it every 3 years, will likely get me through the next 10 or so years while the kids are young. I’m sure it would be great to have potential grandchildren and family able to enjoy the pool in the future too.

I think there might be some snobbery going on with respect to liners. It does seem like a bit of a “pool status downgrade” to install a liner, but I understand functionality is the goal.

I’m probably sticking with plaster since my pool guy has never recommended a liner. His dad apparently took care of this pool in the past too. They could have installed a liner long ago if that’s the type of thing they’d be likely to suggest.

Now does it matter what type of paint you use? I’ve used POR-15 on rusty car parts, and it’s one hell of a material once dry. Perhaps it would be too rigid to use on a pool. And GOOD LUCK ever trying to get it off once on. I spilled some on my garage floor once. A jackhammer would be required to remove it. Yeah, it’s like $60/quart, and I’m not sure if they make it in white. I’ve only used black.

And don’t commercial pools get painted all the time, like the swim lane lines?


Teapot1
Swimming Pool Superstar
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Joined: Thu 29 Apr, 2021 00:43
My Pool: 12000 gallons vinyl liner,

Re: Just Purchased Project - Delaware

Postby Teapot1 » Tue 02 Aug, 2022 17:34

Commercial pools are usually tiled not painted. If you have missing tiles and a poor surface you'll need to repair it but the felt backing underlay will take care of a rough surface, if are a pool snob or follow others who are then the sense of a liner will never settle your desire/ego whatever. Pool companies love to make money with repeat business, even if they can pass it down through the generations never forget that. Me, I built a reputation on putting things right for owners. If you are concerned by bag liners, look at on site liner its 1.5-2mm thick and with a support mesh in the middle is incredibly strong like Armstrong vinyl flooring. They weld that on site from roles of liner material and can usually keep the original fittings. Vinyl liners make pool water chemistry easier as well because you dont need to keep the Alkalinity up and hardness doesnt really mater much either so long as its not too high as with most pool surfaces.

https://www.alkorplan.info/tag/pool-liner/
I may not give you the answer you want to hear, but I will give an honest opinion of your situation as you decribe it.
mknmike
Swimming Pool Pro
Swimming Pool Pro
Posts: 157
Joined: Fri 02 Jul, 2021 21:00

Re: Just Purchased Project - Delaware

Postby mknmike » Tue 02 Aug, 2022 18:38

Teapot1 wrote:Commercial pools are usually tiled not painted.



Say what? The pool we belong to has swim lane lines painted on the bottom of it. I’m pretty confident that it’s not tiled.

Let me see if I can dig up some pictures.

Teapot1 wrote:If you have missing tiles and a poor surface you'll need to repair it but the felt backing underlay will take care of a rough surface, if are a pool snob or follow others who are then the sense of a liner will never settle your desire/ego whatever. Pool companies love to make money with repeat business, even if they can pass it down through the generations never forget that. Me, I built a reputation on putting things right for owners. If you are concerned by bag liners, look at on site liner its 1.5-2mm thick and with a support mesh in the middle is incredibly strong like Armstrong vinyl flooring. They weld that on site from roles of liner material and can usually keep the original fittings. Vinyl liners make pool water chemistry easier as well because you dont need to keep the Alkalinity up and hardness doesnt really mater much either so long as its not too high as with most pool surfaces.

https://www.alkorplan.info/tag/pool-liner/


My pool guy doesn’t return most of my messages. I think he knows I’m a bit too “hands on.” He suggested I use pool patch on those Tiles around the skimmer, and I decided to grout all of them bc I saw gaps in the grout and exposed sides of tiles.


This guy really seems pretty anti-liner. I guess you could use the same argument that you could chemically destroy your PVC pipes too. Anyway, this is what he has to say a BOOT that…

https://youtu.be/MFlikxBpZHA
Teapot1
Swimming Pool Superstar
Swimming Pool Superstar
Posts: 733
Joined: Thu 29 Apr, 2021 00:43
My Pool: 12000 gallons vinyl liner,

Re: Just Purchased Project - Delaware

Postby Teapot1 » Wed 03 Aug, 2022 01:42

Swimming pool Steve has got a few things wrong over time and I havent spoken to him in a few years. There are different grades of liner, the thinest and weakest is the above ground Bestway etc. Then the in ground pools with bag liners which are thicker tougher pvc and finally the on site armoured liner as I have already mentioned and one of the manufacturers videos is there. Can you ruin a liner in 3 years? No not really, yes you can ruin a liner in one go by lowering the pools pH to 4.6 and leaving it like that for a sufficient time to cause shrinking and rippling. Are you likely to do that, not unless you tip 5 gallons of hydrochloric (muratic) acid in the pool and leave it there. So back to reality, yes liner material used to contain heavy metals like cadmium but now they don't in Europe anyway. The formulas were modified to remove the metals but improve the plasticisers to ensure they do last at least a reasonable length of time.
My liner (22 years old) was made around the transitional period so may or may not contain heavy metals. I have installed around a dozen pvc liners over 20 years and none have failed yet. Most manufacturers give a 10year gurantee and 15 years on the weld on site. You do not need to keep the balance absolutely spot on as Steve spoke about, plastic pools (vinyl/glassfibre etc) are much more forgiving chemical wise with the only concern keeping the pH above 7.
With a plaster/pebbletec or tiled pool you have to be much more careful as too lower hardness, alkalinity and pH makes the water aggressive to the cementacious finishes and softens them and they degrade so balancing 3 chemicals is far more involved and a seesaw of adding things that shift the langlier index to and forth.
If you dont like the idea of a liner still, you could get the pool lined by a glass fibre company. There is polyurea sprayed coating.
https://blog.synthesia.com/en/applicati ... -fountains

Or Aquabright ecofinish to look at.
https://www.riverpoolsandspas.com/blog/ ... ming-pools
I may not give you the answer you want to hear, but I will give an honest opinion of your situation as you decribe it.
mknmike
Swimming Pool Pro
Swimming Pool Pro
Posts: 157
Joined: Fri 02 Jul, 2021 21:00

Re: Just Purchased Project - Delaware

Postby mknmike » Thu 04 Aug, 2022 23:10

Teapot1 wrote:
With a plaster/pebbletec or tiled pool you have to be much more careful as too lower hardness, alkalinity and pH makes the water aggressive to the cementacious finishes and softens them and they degrade so balancing 3 chemicals is far more involved and a seesaw of adding things that shift the langlier index to and forth.
If you dont like the idea of a liner still, you could get the pool lined by a glass fibre company. There is polyurea sprayed coating.
https://blog.synthesia.com/en/applicati ... -fountains

Or Aquabright ecofinish to look at.
https://www.riverpoolsandspas.com/blog/ ... ming-pools


This is good stuff.

I think that if I’m going to apply any coating to my pool, it’s going to require propped surface preparation. I wonder if watching this video would help you understand what I’m looking at… now that I seem to have the pool holding water once again.

https://youtu.be/Vt0K1GEdiok

I realize that the coping, tile, and surface/liner are all three different issues I’ve got to address. For now I feel like I’ve bought myself some time with the tile. Trying to figure out what is the next most important item (functionally in my freezing climate, and cosmetically too).

I don’t know yet what type of heaving I get in the winter, and where I should cut a line in the mortar of the bricks because I’m not sure how thick the concrete wall is in my pool. I don’t know if I can assume that if the bricks are only mortared about 2-3’ back, if that’s even necessary.

And is the coping/decking issue a bigger issue than the surface of the pool? Cosmetically, the pool surface seems more important, but on the other hand if pool water is eating away at platter and concrete because the paint is gone and the spots are dark, then perhaps resurfacing is most important.

If I drain the pool to resurface it, should I switch from Bromine to Chlorine? You can see my pool gets lots of sun.

Oh. Determining what to resurface the pool with probably only makes sense to do AFTER I determine what the current coating consists of. My robot collects a bunch of flakes. So next time I empty the robot bag, I will be sure to collect the chips into a container and begin testing to figure out what the “paint” is made of.

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