No Chlorine

Chlorinating, maintaining the right chlorine levels,
chlorine problems. Dichlor, trichlor, cal hypo, bleach,
granules, chlorine pucks and chlorine sticks.
poolretiree
Pool Newbie
Pool Newbie
Posts: 1
Joined: Mon 13 Jul, 2009 13:19
My Pool: 20x40 feet, sand filter, 28,000 gallons
Location: Richmond, Va

No Chlorine

Postby poolretiree » Mon 13 Jul, 2009 13:34

I have had a pool for 15 years. Until last year, never had a problem maintaining free chlorine. Into this year, I cannot maintain any now. Always 0 here and 0.1ppm or less in pool store. I have shocked with 2, 4, 10, 12 lbs of shock and go back and there is nothing the next day. Pool is crystal clean......beautiful water. All other test results are in limits according to pool store. Free is 0, Total is 0.1, combined is 0.1, pH is 7.3, Hardness is 190ppm, Alkalinity with stabilizer correction is 91ppm, Cyanuric Acid is 65ppm, Copper is 0 ppm, Iron is 0 ppm, total dissolved Solids is 1500ppm. Pool is vinyl and 28,000. I have shocked twice this year with large amounts, 10lbs, putting 3lbs in at a time, then 3 more in 2 hours, then 4 two hours later. Same with the 12 lbs. Store always says add 3 or 4 lbs of shock and it will be ok in the morning......nothing in the morning......appreciate any thoughts or advice


fusemaster

No Chlorine

Postby fusemaster » Mon 13 Jul, 2009 18:41

i have the same problem as you with my pool -all levels ok-cant keep chlorine level-driving me nuts!!-searching the internet for solutions-pool owner for 9 years and this problem just started about 2 years ago-iwas able to break the chlorine "lock" in the past years -but not now-ive added mega amounts like you-8-10 pounds of shoch-breaks for the night -next day -gone -please let me know if you find a solution -the only thing ive found is to add sodium hydroxide and sodium hypochloride-or drain pool -let me know if you find something [email protected] -thanks
chem geek
Pool Industry Leader
Pool Industry Leader
Posts: 2382
Joined: Thu 21 Jun, 2007 21:27
Location: San Rafael, California

No Chlorine

Postby chem geek » Mon 13 Jul, 2009 22:14

I wouldn't necessarily trust the pool store numbers and would get your own good test kit: either the Taylor K-2006 kit you can get at a good online price here or the TF100 from tftestkits.net here with the latter kit having 36% more volume of reagents so is less expensive per test.

It is possible that if the chlorine level got to zero at some point that bacteria converted some of the CYA into ammonia. You can get an inexpensive ammonia test kit from a pet/fish/aquarium store. If you've got ammonia, then it can take a LOT of chlorine to get rid of -- at least 8x the ammonia level as cumulative FC to be added. This happened to me in my own pool when I stupidly missed dosing chlorine as the pool was warming up for the season and I describe my experience in this thread though my water also turned dull/cloudy from algae (but my phosphate level is 2000-3000 ppb so my pool is rather unforgiving if I let the chlorine get to zero). I've since added 50 ppm borates to the pool as insurance, though this is the first time in 6+ years that I let the chlorine get too low. The plus side of BBB is that it's inexpensive and simple, but the downside is that it's less convenient and less forgiving. At least I knew exactly what to do and caught the problem before the pool turned green.

Richard
roger c

No Chlorine

Postby roger c » Wed 15 Jul, 2009 07:47

Richard

tried the ammonia test.......showed no (0) ppm. Pool shows no signs of algae...perfectly clear. Shock or bbb next?....what would you suggest........pool is 28,000 gallons..........poolretiree.........thanks for you help so far
chem geek
Pool Industry Leader
Pool Industry Leader
Posts: 2382
Joined: Thu 21 Jun, 2007 21:27
Location: San Rafael, California

No Chlorine

Postby chem geek » Wed 15 Jul, 2009 10:59

I'd do a bucket test to get a rough idea of how much chlorine is needed to get a reading.

Also, are you sure you or the pool store aren't using a DPD chlorine test (shades of pink/red) that is getting bleached out with high FC (above 10 ppm, usually)? An inexpensive OTO test (shades of yellow; orange/red with very high FC) won't get bleached out and a FAS-DPD test is the best since it is accurate, can measure within 0.2 ppm for FC and CC, and won't bleach out and can measure to 50 ppm.

Also, though the pool store says you have CYA in the water, if you are only losing chlorine during the day and not at night (i.e. if you add some after the sun goes down but it's still there in the morning), then the CYA may be zero or too low.

In a bucket test, 1/4 teaspoon of 6% bleach is 10 ppm FC. So you can see how much is needed to add to a bucket of pool water before you start to get an FC reading (after letting it mix; test a few minutes after adding and again an hour or two later). To make sure you are doing things correctly, you can start out with a bucket of tap water to make sure you do indeed get a reading (you can even see if your test kit bleaches out and can try dilution with tap water to measure higher FC levels roughly).
Frank D

No Chlorine

Postby Frank D » Sat 15 Aug, 2009 06:56

Went away and got green pool on return. Got the algie cleared up and cleaned the filter. Water is crystal clear. I cannot get my free chlorine to register. My stableizer is at about 25 and all other levels look ok. Put in 10 liquid shocks. 3 oxidiser bags. Registers no free chlorine however you can smell the chlorine in the pool. Is my chlorine LOCKED UP and how do I fix it.
chem geek
Pool Industry Leader
Pool Industry Leader
Posts: 2382
Joined: Thu 21 Jun, 2007 21:27
Location: San Rafael, California

No Chlorine

Postby chem geek » Sat 15 Aug, 2009 12:30

If the CYA level dropped, then when the chlorine dropped to zero which let algae grow, bacteria could have converted some of the CYA into ammonia. You can figure out how much chlorine it will take to get rid of it by using the bucket test described in my post above. You can also test the ammonia level with an inexpensive ammonia test kit from a pet/fish/aquarium store.
ALL BLUE POOLS

No Chlorine

Postby ALL BLUE POOLS » Sun 23 Aug, 2009 13:39

ALL BLUE POOLS 602-943-1909
YOU HAVE STATED IT OVER AND OVER BUT YOU DO NOT SEE IT YOUR STABILZER AKA"CYA" IS TOO LOW GET IT UP TO 100 TO 150% OR KEEP THE POOL STORE IN BUSSINES AND WELL WORN PATH TO IT. THE POOL INDUSTRY PUT TO REST"STABILIZER LOCK MYTH" STABIZER IS AN ACID IT NOT ONLY UMBRELLA'S THE POOL FROM THE SUN BUT CAUSES THE CHLORINE TO WORK AS AN ACID CAUSES THE CHLORINE TO BE MORE EFFECTIVE.
#2 GET THE LEVEL OF CHLORINE UP IT IS SUMMER! IF YOUR AFRAID OF HIGH CHLORNE LEVELS ADD SALT TO YOUR POOL YOU WILL NOT FEEL THE EFFECTS OF HIGHER CHLORINE LEVELS AND GET TO ENJOY A SALT POOL FOR PENNIES. NO. NOT A SALT GENERATOR JUST "SALT" 1500- 2500PPM 40LBS = APROX 200PPM PER BAG. OH DOENT THE POOL INDUSTRY LOVE THESE SITUATIONS. YOU ARE WANTING PERFECT WATER SO DO I BUT YOU ARE TRYING TO CONTROL A LARGE BODY OF WATER WITH ONLY ONE POOL FOR 15 YEARS BUT YOU SHOULD YNOW THE ANSWER RIGHT CAUSE YOUR NOT OUT OF IT YOU HAVE BEEN DOING THIS FOR 15 YEARS!!
THE POOL STORE HAS YOU ON A SHORT CHAIN GET"AQUA CHECK" TEST STRIPS WITH A YRLLOW CAP AND READ THE INSTRUCTIONS IT WILL REALLY HELP. TOO MANY PEOPLE RELY ON THE POOL STORE FOR COMFORT AND BELIEVE EVERTHING THEY HEAR .
I AM 35YEARS POOLS AND EVEN I CANNOT ALWAYS LISTEN TO THE POOL INDUSTRY UNLESS I WANT TO BE RULED BY THIER LIES. IT IS ALL ABOUT MONEY. THE BASICS ARE STILL THE SAME.
STABIZER 100%-150% CHLOR LOCK A MYTH
CHLORINE 5.0 AND ABOVE FOR SUMMER
PH 7,4-7.6
THE ONLY EXTRA IS SALT IT IS THE UNTOLD SECRET TO KEEPING CHEMICALS FROM AFFECTING YOU
AND MAINTAINING WATER CHEMISTRY WHERE YOU DON'T WORRY ABOUT IT. I GO ONCE A MONTH TO MY
ACCOUNTS IN THE SUMMER AND EVERY 2 MONTH WINTER. I HAVE DEVELPOPED A SPECIAL TAB FEEDER NOT A TAB EATER,
YOUR STABILIZER IS TOOOOOO LOW GET IT UP. ALAN :thumbup:
chem geek
Pool Industry Leader
Pool Industry Leader
Posts: 2382
Joined: Thu 21 Jun, 2007 21:27
Location: San Rafael, California

No Chlorine

Postby chem geek » Sun 23 Aug, 2009 17:03

ALL BLUE POOLS wrote:YOU HAVE STATED IT OVER AND OVER BUT YOU DO NOT SEE IT YOUR STABILZER AKA"CYA" IS TOO LOW GET IT UP TO 100 TO 150% OR KEEP THE POOL STORE IN BUSSINES AND WELL WORN PATH TO IT. THE POOL INDUSTRY PUT TO REST"STABILIZER LOCK MYTH" STABIZER IS AN ACID IT NOT ONLY UMBRELLA'S THE POOL FROM THE SUN BUT CAUSES THE CHLORINE TO WORK AS AN ACID CAUSES THE CHLORINE TO BE MORE EFFECTIVE.

Alan,

Please stop using all caps. You don't know what you are talking about recommending 100-150 ppm (is that what you mean by 100 to 150%?) for CYA and that it makes chlorine more effective. This is absolutely positively not true -- it's the opposite. CYA will reduce the rate of chlorine loss from sunlight, but it mostly does so by combining with chlorine to form compounds that are not strong sanitizers or oxidizers. See this post for much more info and links to scientific articles and analysis of pool studies about this.

Understanding the chlorine/CYA relationship has helped over 20,000 pool owners at The PoolForum and 10,000 pool owners at Trouble Free Pool plus many from this forum and those are just the people who bothered to register (there are many more lurkers).

Richard
Chlorine deprived

No Chlorine

Postby Chlorine deprived » Mon 31 Aug, 2009 18:07

i cant keep Chlorine either, i have a SW system. ph 7.4 cya 77 Zero Chlorine mineral level 2500 pool store, 2900 unit and 3300 test strip, my pool is crystal clear i have a 17000 gal.vinyl pool and an over sized pump 3hp, 8 returns ( i have a reversal valve to skim off the warmer top water thourgh the returns while i am heating it, rarely do i reverse it) I can turn the pool over in about 5 hours.. I figure it pumps about 80-100gpm Anyway since i installed this pool 3 seasons ago i dont think i EVER had chlorine out of the Salt system or the amounts are being eaten away... I can now hold chlorine for a few ( 5 ,6) days if i throw some in but thats about it since I finally saw in a forum about Phosphates and that seemed to help ( they are now zero)

My pool was very green at opening this year(mesh cover) ( So Central Pa ) and had an small algae plume. twice early on when after i back washed the sand filter, a white cloud came out of all returns but the cloudiness disapated in 20 minutes or so. To get rid of the phosphates i used Phos Floc and phos free.

amonia test too? to start? Help ( i want to find out if this salt water thing is actually working before the warranty runs out)

Mike

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